Admin.- Etiquette

ID: 78122
Admin.- Etiquette 
22.Nov.05 11:24

Konrad Birkner † 12.08.2014 (D)
Articles: 2333
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Konrad Birkner † 12.08.2014


Model Admins need to cooperate, as a majority of two votes is required.

If an admin has modified a new entry, the uploader shall get a message (admin. remarks)

- in case of rejection: reason why

- in case of acceptance after modification by admin: "see correction"

- in case of correction without voting: "see correction"

This appears advisable to maintain motivation of members which are eager to learn. The note may be short and dry, but never harsh or even aggressiv. If severe criticism seems indicated, it should always happen via e-mail or phone (skype, if there) in direct contact with the uploader. A cc mail to another admin may be useful.

Very important ! : If an admin disagrees with an other admins change he must not simply cancel it. He should discuss the case to come to an agreement.

It is useful to block the complete proposal (and not to forget: notify the uploader by remark "under clarification") and to discuss by e-mail or phone (if language permits). This shall avoid to put admins negotiation in public (and even keep it documented in the model change history).


Change suggestions cannot be modified by admin. Only acceptance or rejection is possible.

In case of a rejection the Uploader should be told why (by admin remarks).


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English and other languages 
04.Oct.07 13:45

Ernst Erb (CH)
Articles: 5745
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Ernst Erb

We had quite some complaints last time about unfriendly incidents with administrators. Such incidents are not very common but each should be avoided if possible. We face also language problems and cultural differnces. I will look out for model administrators who understand different mentalities and customs in other but German speaking countries.

The aim must be that those can cover the language and that the existing model admins have lesser work and tehrefore can get into better discussions with our members.

Each model administrator for other languages must have a pretty good knowledge in English.
At the moment we have nearly all texts about administrating in German only. Therefore it will be difficult for new model admins to do their work properly right at the beginning. I hope that the existing model admins give good advice and help newcomers to get firm in administrating.

I once again have to state here that YES, a model must have correct data - but NO: Data has not to be complete. In no case a new model may be deleted  only by lack of full data.

We all know that filling in data later is more time consuming than getting the data right at the beginning. Therefore a nice question and giving reasons for that may be possible and is welcome. But if the lock stays for more than 3 days we just accept a correct model.

I just added Mario Bermejo as new model admin mainly for the Spanish speaking community. He can naturally also help Alessandro De Poi and Marco Gilardetti for Italian and  Patrice Zeissloff, Gidi Verheijen and Jean Beseme for French.

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Cultural differences between the USA and Europe - and RMorg 
27.May.09 20:16

Ernst Erb (CH)
Articles: 5745
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Ernst Erb

I was called in to look into a thread in the ARF lately. There you could see what different opinions one can have for the same thing, but it changed address or was deleted - you find my summary there, not corresponding with this below.

We could solve things which really can upset - even if it is never meant like this: "snotty answers". We have learned that only Americans should serve Americans. We need somebody who helps out at admin-en or as model admin. Who can help?

For the near future we will never be the candy machine without slot or some activity before candies can be taken out.
We should ask ourselves: "What can I do for RMorg and not what can RMorg do for me" in the first place - because only this spirit gives results (content = candies). But this can only do a minority and therefore we will ever se frustration. We have to differ between well based frustration and that.

Sorry, this can't be short (or just read the summary below):
(Note: "Quoted" terms are actual quotes from the recent exchange at that forum.)

We have seen here that RMorg has both its supporters and its detractors. Opinions range from: "... is about the last place I would consider..." to: "RMorg is a goldmine!"

Each of these is understandable, and we can learn from both. The topic here is: How can we get top quality and at the same time tell an uploader in a friendly manner that his data has errors, is a duplicate of data that we already have, etc.? You would be astonished how often members have the set right in front of them but still submit data with errors.

Sometimes the uploader knows ten times more than the voluntary admin - but how is this poor admin supposed to check if he doubts or is unsure of something unless he asks for proof? And if he does, he risks getting accused of "imposing ridiculous tests" or (and I'm sure this is the most essential issue of this thread) making "snotty comments", etc., and the uploader will write "It felt like a slap on the face when I offered them some information ..."

It is true: Some of our voluntary administrators on occasion have given and do give short answers in a language they may not manage well and to members who are culturally different. We even had two admins whom I had to dismiss because they behaved 'bossy' instead of feeling that they have to be good 'butlers' (who can even be friends of the 'owner'). In order to better serve our members in the USA, logic would dictate that we need to have some good admins in the USA. We took a major first step toward this: One of our most active members from the USA is ready to step in as a model admin. We need two independent admins ('checks and balances', you know...). It is wonderful that Tom will be helping in special cases and that Don Cavey will assist you if you address him. Many will probably say "Must be an European thing." Perhaps it is (I'm Swiss), but it depends on you to become more American -- by participating with good faith or by sending a contact form (which can be found on the bottom link of any page) -- and call a spade a spade. We never can change a system by just making general allegations.

For those who see RMorg as "His little Club" or as for "the chosen few", there can not be much hope that they would ever see us in a positive manner. But anyone who really has taken the time to find out more about us would come to the conclusion that we might just be the nearest thing to "... the world's largest single location for radio information..." -- built up by about 4000 members. More than 10 thousand members (late in 2012) felt it is worth it to overcome the hurdles. Nobody is limiting us to a hundred new members a month but the hurdles. I add:

It is not only the size (78 000 US models, 285 000 US schematics) but the special framework, the seeking for quality, the relational database (Oracle) etc. True: Complexity is not everybody's choice. We are trying hard to create an Encyclopedia, not only a collection catalog (coffee table book), photo album or schematic collection. In other words, we're trying to create a place for those who believe: If I want information about something, I'd like to have a comprehensive source where it's all there in one place.

A third issue where we see opposing views is "I don't use pay sites. As soon as I see that, I'm gone." Or: "A "pay-only" RMorg would change the essence of what RMorg is!"

My answer will only be understood by a few because it is a paradox: True love can not be bought; we have to work for it if we want to keep it. We give the non-paying users enough information to be able to identify their set, to know more about the brand, the model line, etc., but we offer more for those who help to build our information base. We must face the fact that the majority will not be happy with this. As some have said: There are enough other sites that have information.

As long as I finance the organization we would not need any payment and hurdles - but then we would mostly have users who want to retrieve information but not contribute - and there would be not much information to seek for. But we accept option 1 since it will have no credit points for schematics and large pictures until he/she loads up something. Some additional data on a model or collecting prices will also do! By the way: Forum articles do not count. Strictly speaking, RMorg has never been "a pay site" but some contribution is needed - and a certain spirit.

We have to consider this issue: "I got a warning letter after only 3 schematic and 0 picture downloads." Most users seem not to know that an internet server has no way of differentiating between simply looking at a schematic or actually downloading it etc. It can only treat any access to a schematic as a 'download'. Soon: For each such 'download' we will bring up a window which explains how many more schematics can be viewed before UACS stops this. The link 'Register as new member' begins with this: 'Thank you for your interest in becoming a member. We are looking for active individuals whose reason for joining is to help keeping the spirit of 'Collectors helping Collectors' alive.' I must confess that less than 50% of the members have ever uploaded something... and yet we still show more than 500 000 pictures/schematics. Sorry, but "make it simple or just forget it" is not applicable for such an undertaking.

When you read my preceding posts, you received answers - which some just overlooked. You also received an answer proposing the creation of "two 'classes' of members". We don't dare to form a "pay site" unless we have the quality which then one would have to expect and a 'nucleus' of admins who can answer possible complaints in a fast and friendly manner. But this thread was valuable for me in that:

(1) I was able to understand that we need an American model admin, plus more members who can be addressed;

(2) I was able to explain why it is not possible for us to be that "simple";

(3) we will be able to provide UACS status information for members who have never uploaded or for members who may be approaching their limit.

If you feel like you "have to jump through hoops like circus animals to join this little club", then please don't. I strongly recommend that you first go to the source (RMorg) and read up on it, and then only join if you have a positive feeling/understanding about what the hurdles are for. One should never join an organization half-heartedly, or above all with negative feelings about it.

It is also clear that if something goes wrong, some will seem to give up and be upset for life over it -- and others will see it as a challenge to change things.

Here you find the statistics for 2012.


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