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perpetuum: Idler wheel source.

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Forum » Radios and other type of sets (Physics) etc. » MODELS DISPLAYED » perpetuum: Idler wheel source.
           
Paul E. Pinyot † 2013
Paul E. Pinyot  † 2013
 
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21.Nov.10 19:48

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After a long search and a few unanswered e-mails, I found an idler wheel source here:  Click here.   The cost is $25 with exchange of your old wheel. I measured the old wheel.  The dimensions listed match just about perfectly.

There are more parts than idler wheels on this web site.

Paul.


1499-50 OD = 1.77 in

Idler drive wheel for Perpetuum-Ebner, Grundig, Telfunken, Trav-Ler and other record players.

Replacement Comments:
Replaces P-E part 101390 for 33, 34, 66 models; Grundig part 9002017 for PE 66 model; Telefunken part 9102017 for TW 566 model; Trav-Ler 10-1390 for PE 66 model.

Specifications:
OD (inches): 1.770
ID (inches): 0.117
Height (inches): 0.220
Thickness (inches): 0.097

Comments:
In stock - will ship once your old part and payment received.

Part # Description Replacement Comment Availability Price Add To Cart
1499-50 Phono idler wheel - Requires mail in of old part with order     Available $25.00

This article was edited 23.Nov.10 14:51 by Ernst Erb .

Ernst Erb
Ernst Erb
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27.Nov.10 09:46

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An information by Paul Pinyot which we had to delete in an other post:
 

New Drive Belt

I found a listing for this model's belt with: turntableneedles.com/- Go to "Drive Belts"  Then choose the turn table option, then select the "Find My Player" button and go to PE listing.  Then select the 4230.  That is it. The site lists an FBL6.6 Flat Belt, Large 6.6 Inch for $13.95 as of this date. I ordered one.  I have installed it and the belt works great!

AC motor capacitors

I have to convert the motor from 50 to 60 Hz operation (160Vac stamped on this unit). I am seeing a little vibration or flutter.  So I looked up AC capacitors and ordered a selection. I will experiment with the value starting at 1uf (installed for 50Hz) and decrease for minimum heat, minimum flutter and smooth 60 Hz operation.  The source is Mouser on this page. The origonal AC capacitor in my turntable is 1 uf 200 vac.  I ordered a selection of 250vac caps for other motor applicaitons (i.e., Philips BD753A).

 

Bob Timms
Bob Timms
 
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12.Feb.11 19:34

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Hello Ernst

The motor on my PE 4230 is running hot. I do not know what normal should be.

This originally was a 220V German Radio which I am running on 120 VAC here in the U.S.

I turned the motor shaft to help get correct platter speeds. It plays very well and speed are correct, but motor seems hot to me.

The motor voltage is 211 VAC the original capacitor is .15 @ 450 VAC  I believe this value has to be changed as I am running on 120 VAC @ 60 Hz

How did you make out with yours, when changing capacitor values?

I think the capacitor effects the timing phase of the windings, but not educated in that line.

Any light or help you can shed on this will be appreciated.

Thank you for the source for the new belt I now have on it.

UPDATE

I put a .1 capacitor in . Motor will not start at all.

I have a .12 in now and it starts and runs fine , but still motor is hot. I can hold my hand on the windings but it is very hot. Maybe Normal ????

Thank You

Bob Timms

This article was edited 12.Feb.11 22:25 by Bob Timms .

Georg Richter
Georg Richter
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13.Feb.11 03:33

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Assuming that the coils have no isolation problem - it is quite normal that certain shaded pole motors are running hot after a while, even if the mains voltage and frequency are as specified. Some of them have to rewire their (two) coils for different voltages (e.g. 110/220V), or was of special voltage, connected to a tap on the primary of the mains transformer.

Their speed is generally dedicated to the mains frequency.Usually you have to change the pulley if the mains frequency is different. Adjusting the speed with capacitors is not the best way.

Best Regards,

GR

Bob Timms
Bob Timms
 
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13.Feb.11 13:16

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I turned the motor shaft down to .190. I was hoping lowering the cap it would help the motor run cooler.

50/60 Hz

Bob Timms

Bob Timms
Bob Timms
 
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15.Feb.11 16:08

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org/r/perpetuum_pe_stereo_4230.htmlI need a Translation to English of the Complete Paragraph in this booklet

Starts out

Umste des Plattenspielers von 50 auf 60 Hz

 

Thanks

Bob Timms

This article was edited 15.Feb.11 16:15 by Bob Timms .

Paul E. Pinyot † 2013
Paul E. Pinyot  † 2013
 
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15.Feb.11 19:08

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When changing the frequency, there is the possibility to replace the motor role for a special role. The conversion let the expediency drove through your specialized handler.

I get the idea they want you to take it to the local shop. Use the word "Capacitor" in for "role".

Paul.
 

This article was edited 15.Feb.11 19:11 by Paul E. Pinyot † 2013 .

Bob Timms
Bob Timms
 
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15.Feb.11 21:32

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Paul

Thank you.

Tested my original capacitor today. Marked .15 but checks .27  New one on the way. Should fix my problem,

 

Bob Timms

 

Paul E. Pinyot † 2013
Paul E. Pinyot  † 2013
 
USA  Articles: 187
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15.Feb.11 22:11

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That is typical of almost all older capacitors (except for precision specified caps).  They have an asymmetrical tolerance rating like +30% - 5%.  It was harder to manufacture tight tolerances back then.  So they let the cap value go high and kept the minimum tight to the marked value.  You will also see this in old but still good electrolytic.

Today the caps are much much tighter tolerance. 
 
I have been reading about motor caps.  I still have not found a formula.  But I did see it stated that the cap should be as small as possible but still insure reliable starting.  This keeps the eddie currents (i.e., heat) to a minimum.
 
Remember there is a variable starting load on the motor depending on what speed the selector is on and if there is a heavy record (i.e., lacquer 78 rpm) on the platter.  And line voltage will also have a slight effect on starting torque. 
 
Test your new capacitor solution under different starting conditions.
 
Paul.
 
 
  
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